If you read it, then you know that TB couldn't really get an answer to that question. And if he couldn't answer that one, he definitely was going to come up empty for this one:
Who is the greatest coach in Princeton Athletic history?
The question of who was first is unanswerable because the records don't really clear it up. As TB said yesterday, there were two rowing coaches listed in the 1880s, but were they really coaches? And then if not, then was it the "unofficial" football coach in 1899, or the baseball coach in 1900?
The question of who is the best is unanswerable because anyone is entitled to an opinion and a case can be made for a lot of coaches throughout history here. Add to that the fact that there is no apples to apples comparison possible for a lot of those coaches, and really you can make a case for several.
It's not a huge list though.
As TB started to think about the greatest coaches in program history, he thought of the impossibility of comparing people like Betty Constable and Bill Roper. Constable coached the women's squash team from 1971 through 1991, going 117-16 and winning 12 Howe Cup national championships.
By the way, Betty Constable's maiden name was "Howe," and the trophy for the women's squash national championship is named for her family.
Roper was the football coach at Princeton for 17 seasons between 1906 and 1930. During that time he went 89-28-16 (no Princeton football coach has ever won more games) and 11 national championships.
How do you compare them?
For that matter, how do you compare Roper to Charlie Caldwell (70-30-3, a national title and a Heisman Trophy winner) with Dick Colman (75-33-0, four Ivy titles)? Comparing different eras within the same sport is hard enough without adding in the vast variety of the sports.
The point is that it's all subjective, and you can make a case for a few. In fact, there are two current Princeton head coaches - men's track and field coach Fred Samara and women's lacrosse coach Chris Sailer - who would have to be in the conversation for the top 10 coaches this school has ever seen.
What makes someone the greatest coach ever anyway? You have to have won, a lot, at the very highest levels. You have to have done something that nobody else in your sport has done. And you had to do it for a long time.
Where does that leave someone like former field hockey coach Kristen Holmes-Winn? Her record is extraordinary - 164-80 record with 12 Ivy titles in 14 years and the crowning jewel of her tenure. She also has something no other Ivy League field hockey coach has - an NCAA championship.
Ah, but is that long enough to be considered?
By the way, if you're looking for a rising star, there's Holmes-Winn's replacement Carla Tagliente, who in two years has an NCAA semifinal and quarterfinal appearance (Holmes-Winn's first Final Four was in her seventh year).
TigerBlog has a sense, though, that if he asked 100 knowledgeable Princeton fans who the greatest coach in Princeton history is, he'd get an pretty large majority of the votes for two people - Bill Tierney and Pete Carril.
You know their accomplishments. Carril in 29 years as the men's basketball coach won 514 games, 13 Ivy League titles and the 1975 NIT. He also took Princeton to 11 NCAA tournaments and had the great win over UCLA in the 1996 NCAA tournament, his last.
As for Tierney, he spent 22 years here and won six NCAA tournaments, went to eight NCAA finals and went to 10 Final Fours. He won 14 Ivy League championships. He did all this with a program that had never been to the NCAA tournament prior to his arrival.
Those are insane numbers.
Why go through all of this the last two days? It started last week, when Tierney was in town and stopped by. He also stopped in on someone who, if she wants to stay here long enough, will make a serious run at being up there with the best of them.
Her record after 11 years is 232-93. She's won six Ivy League championships and gone to seven NCAA tournaments (and two WNITs) for a program that had not been in the NCAA tournament prior to her arrival. She's also won an NCAA tournament game (just the second in league history) and got the league's first at-large bid for either men or women.
TB is talking about Courtney Banghart, of course.
And it was Courtney who texted this picture to TB late last week:
The greatest coach in Princeton history? Debatable.
The picture of Banghart and Tierney? Well, let TB add it together for you:
* 22 Ivy titles
* 34 NCAA tournaments (including Tierney's nine at Denver)
* 470-179 record at Princeton (interestingly, Banghart has coached 325 games at Princeton, while Tierney coached 324 here)
Hey, in this case, a picture was worth about 900 words.
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